lonewolff
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Reply #30 Posted on: October 02, 2014, 05:01:53 am |
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"Guest"
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As usual, it's not black and white, it depends of the projects. For instance with ENIGMA, there is few developers and sometimes the developers didn't test enough, so we had a lot of bugs. But with GM, it's not perfect either, despite it's closed source and they have a big team working on it, there is important bugs which remains for a long time.
Absolutely agree! At the moment ENIGMA seems to be in this state though
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lonewolff
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Reply #32 Posted on: October 02, 2014, 05:40:51 am |
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"Guest"
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Just like here in México, but that doesn't make my statement any less true.
Now, not every FOSS project might be wort it's salt for some or even for most of us, but that doesn't make all the rest trash, just as the fact that to be safe from malware using windows you need, at least 2 third party applications.
That just makes your arguments irrelevant. Some people prefer blond's, some prefer brunette's, some don't care. Whatever gets your rocks off
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edsquare
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Reply #33 Posted on: October 02, 2014, 06:09:54 am |
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Location: The throne of ringworld Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 402
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Just like here in México, but that doesn't make my statement any less true.
Now, not every FOSS project might be wort it's salt for some or even for most of us, but that doesn't make all the rest trash, just as the fact that to be safe from malware using windows you need, at least 2 third party applications.
That just makes your arguments irrelevant.
Some people prefer blond's, some prefer brunette's, some don't care.
Whatever gets your rocks off
My arguments are irrelevant? Well then so are yours, since any claim made without proof can be dismised without proofs too.
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A child of five would understand this. Send someone to fetch a child of five. Groucho Marx
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edsquare
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Reply #34 Posted on: October 02, 2014, 06:13:46 am |
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Location: The throne of ringworld Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 402
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By the way and as aside, this kind of discussion/arguments/topics do turn people away from ENIGMA, if the same people that use it already and say they are going to help developing it are the first ones to bash it.
But whatever floats your boat eh?
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A child of five would understand this. Send someone to fetch a child of five. Groucho Marx
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egofree
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Reply #36 Posted on: October 02, 2014, 07:53:23 am |
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Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 601
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Absolutely agree!
At the moment ENIGMA seems to be in this state though
First, when i discovered ENIGMA and i tried to make a game, i was also complaining, because it had a lot of missing features and it had also a lot of bugs. It was unfortunate, because i felt it had a huge potential. But now, the situation has improved and i see also the positive side of a 'not finished' open-source project : as a programmer, i can add new features and fix also bugs, and learn new things in game development. I mean, in a famous and stable open-source project, i guess it should be much harder to come and modify the project as a new comer. In ENIGMA, as there is few developers and there is still a lot of work to do, it's easy to get involved. I worked a little bit on LateralGM, and the only negative side was that often there is almost no comments and the variables are not declared with comprehensible names (Variables names with only one letter). Especially in open-source projects, i think it's very important that we should help others programmers understand what we made, as very often we will not be in contact. For instance, with LateralGM, there is several developers who added new features, but are not more involved with this project.
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« Last Edit: October 02, 2014, 08:03:51 am by egofree »
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TheExDeus
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Reply #37 Posted on: October 02, 2014, 10:07:03 am |
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1860
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At the moment ENIGMA seems to be in this state though It's currently in this state: Which is good enough for me. And getting better by the day.
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Darkstar2
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Reply #38 Posted on: October 02, 2014, 02:14:42 pm |
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 1238
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I guess we can learn from this that there are pros and cons to everything. I guess ENIGMA being open source, means you are not or don't have to be tied with original development, you can simply take ENIGMA and modify it your pleasing, without waiting for approval, but you have to at all times make the source available freely and allow anybody to merge with your changes. That's what open source is, allows people to contribute to it, either as a team or on their own. Perhaps ENIGMA's downfall is not the fact it is not closed source but certain circumstances, aside from being attached to GM's rusty knob, certain people did not finish what they started for whatever bloody reasons But I guess these problems that can be faced with closed source software, that are bug ridden, rushed to the market then later obsoleted and abandoned.... It's probably pointless to discuss about making ENIGMA closed source, it ain't gonna happen I don't think the majority of the devs involved would agree, so why not make the best of it, unless GMS 2 due next year really shocks all of us and sends this project in its coffin ! but that would be a long shot I reckon pigs will have wings, fly upsidedown and struck by lightning 3 times in the same day ! lol!
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Goombert
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Reply #41 Posted on: October 02, 2014, 06:07:12 pm |
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Location: Cappuccino, CA Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 2993
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I find this whole topic to be a huge conspiracy honestly, why all of the sudden is this such a huge issue when nobody is even trying to make a commercial game with ENIGMA? I could understand if someone had something ready to release and had concerns about licensing their product, but nobody does, so exactly how did this all of the sudden become an issue?
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I think it was Leonardo da Vinci who once said something along the lines of "If you build the robots, they will make games." or something to that effect.
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time-killer-games
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Reply #42 Posted on: October 02, 2014, 06:23:43 pm |
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"Guest"
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Actually hairy, that's not my only point. Contributors come and go. They explode with contributions one day and die in a car accident or lose interest in the project all-together the next. If you guys only gave specific people the code, that's self-destruction. ENIGMA right now is a huge heaping pile of shit no one notices or cares about other than like what? Two people in all of planet earth? Those two people are develops so they don't count they don't just make games with ENIGMA they are willing to put up with the shitty engine because they know how to tweak it until it does something right, little do they know, nothing hardly ever in a decade gets fixed around here. Something gets fixed then ten things break. I agree with Bob.
Closed-sourcing the shit heap will do nothing but decrease it's chances of becoming anything more than what it is, for the lack of a better word, "good soil". That's right, poop. Less people will be willing to help develop it. And the nature of closed-source is that the people who are in charge won't be as willing to share their code with "just anybody". And boom! Enigma gets wiped out just like the dinosaurs.
Robert and sorlok can't do it all by themselves, that's a joke. No one can do all that kinda work in such small numbers. We need to grow our community, not die it off.
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« Last Edit: October 02, 2014, 06:54:12 pm by time-killer-games »
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Goombert
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Reply #43 Posted on: October 02, 2014, 06:37:56 pm |
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Location: Cappuccino, CA Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 2993
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I do agree with TKG on this front, but not entirely. Two people in all of planet earth? Currently there are about 5 people browsing, and 10 people have posted today. obert B Colton, time-killer-games, lonewolff, sorlok_reaves, Darkstar2 Also our Twitter has reached 421 followers, and its just from other people retweeting us and following. https://twitter.com/EnigmaGamedevSomething gets fixed then ten things break. There's a reason for this, and it's that all of these problems are inter-connected, fixing a broken function is easy you fix it and that's it. I've fixed working_directory and it's worked ever since the same as GM8.1 for several months now. A good example of what you speak about is the platform code, because Win32 was tightly integrated with the child window removing it had to break everything before getting to the more correct behavior we have now where scaling also works on other platforms and in the process XLIB also seriously improved, you can now hide the title bar, make the window stay on top, and check the keyboard directly.
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« Last Edit: October 02, 2014, 06:47:36 pm by Robert B Colton »
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I think it was Leonardo da Vinci who once said something along the lines of "If you build the robots, they will make games." or something to that effect.
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edsquare
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Reply #44 Posted on: October 02, 2014, 06:47:01 pm |
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Location: The throne of ringworld Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 402
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I find this whole topic to be a huge conspiracy honestly, why all of the sudden is this such a huge issue when nobody is even trying to make a commercial game with ENIGMA? I could understand if someone had something ready to release and had concerns about licensing their product, but nobody does, so exactly how did this all of the sudden become an issue?
100% with you man.
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A child of five would understand this. Send someone to fetch a child of five. Groucho Marx
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