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Author Topic: Mac's 3D  (Read 8307 times)
Offline (Unknown gender) Darkstar2
Reply #15 Posted on: January 28, 2015, 12:28:11 am
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Unlike some indie developers, this is my hobby, I'm not actively developing - I have many projects in mind and many ideas but no time to execute them - as to my writing - I type fast you wouldn't believe, so writing those 100 page books is easy for me, at 100-150wpm, much faster than the time it would take me to make a game. :P  Jealous of who ? I don't give a fuck :P 

Maybe you misunderstood:

1) It's true that a lot of indie games are crap - it's one thing to have the skill to develop, if you don't have the skill the write a story and proper game, then you won't make a decent game.  You could be an excellent C++ / GML coder and excellent  graphics designer and modeler, but you need a proper story and gameplay......how many indie developers have all it takes to make decent game ? :D

2) As far as non indie games, many are decent, but some are garbage.  I have followed the gaming industry on the PC for a very long time, FAR long before I started getting interesting in gaymaker, and I can tell you I have played really awful shite, they were not indie games, they were hyped disappointments, go check gamespot and many game reivews you will see the many sucky games and comments from people.  I did not say all non indie games are shite, I said many indie games are shite, and I did not comment on your points because in some cases I agree - I too have heard the same comments from console gamers in regards to the amount of trash available.......yes, a lot of indie trash :D  But also there are non indie games that are very bad as well.

Here, let's talk about MAX PAYNE (first edition) it was hyped for so many years.....when it came down to it it was a big fat ass disappointment......you could count the polygons with your hand, lighting effects were utter rubbish, level design was subpar, ending was crap.

Let's go way back to the DOS days and DUKE NUKEM 3D......another piece of shite hype........First level, ok.......but as you progressed it was so fucking boring and the level design was shite......was I an indie dev back then, fuck no, and I still am not !

Look at all the games that were released on the PC, can you honestly keep a straight face and say ALL of them were decent ??? many avid PC gamers would certainly disagree with you, and guess what, they are not all jealous indie developers LOL!  I was very critical of certain game myself at a time when I knew fuck all about C++ or GML !

As to multiplayer, unless you are playing with friends or people you know, I learned a long time ago that there are many cheaters online and a lot of people who ruin the games for everyone !! Team killers, bad players, ragers, etc.  So yeah - it's obvious now that game companies bank on the multiplayer aspect, and by doing so they put less focus on single player campaigns, which is why they are so damn short.
To an avid multiplayer game, that is a non issue,
to those of us who are more into single player, that is a big motherfucker of an issue :D

The point I am trying to make here is that if you made those kind of comments (that you made to me) on a PC gaming forum you would probably be torn a new arse and flamed like crazy, but since this is a friendly community, there is none of this here......but I have experience with these type of gaming forums, you never want to talk like that to game critics lol !

So all my comments are made as a long time GAMER,
not a developer, because I could not do better myself, and I am not fucking jealous because this is not my fucking field - if it were I'd be working for big companies like UBISOFT, EA, etc.....and making big games.......not working with toys :D

As a GAMER I have also played many excellent games......

But opinions on games are very subjective.....Some people like a specific game whilst another hates it.

Yes I did mention long ago I would love to make MYST type games, because I played MYST ( I have all the MYST series in their original box I had purchased in my shelf) and I liked the concept.  I mentioned my interest in adventure games, point and click, interactive games and my desire to make some, but always as a hobby.  Making these games (As you know) is very time consuming, time I don't have, and designing skills / modeling skills I don't have either.  One thing I do intend to work on is building engines to allow easy creation of point and click and similar games to cabin escape 3D and the other 3D game you made......

I still play PC games and still critical about some of them, positive and negative, but always as a gamer. I don't consider myself by all means an indie developer, not even close......just a hobbyist who has projects and ideas, but lack of time.....just like ENIGMA developers.  I hope this is more clear :D

and as to your point about flappy bird, yeah agreed.

as to your point on multiplayer extending the game experience, again very much agree, providing you play with friends, good teams, good players, etc.
otherwise random players, cheating players, ragers, etc, nope, spoils the game.
Perhaps you never played much online PC games mate, and you never experienced team killers, idiots, ragers, aim bot cheaters etc.......you never played on COD, BF, halo, etc, etc, etc. or you must have played with a closed circle of friends only, because if you did you'd know what I mean.
In my time when I played MP a lot we had regulars, good players, but you'd often get the random shite that joined and team killed and used aimbot and the funny part, people admitting it and cussing you out.
So yeah, multiplayer games.......too much cheating FUCKS. there is always some *****z out there with the upper hand who will go lengths in cheating.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2015, 04:41:34 am by Darkstar2 » Logged
Offline (Male) Rusky
Reply #16 Posted on: January 29, 2015, 01:35:14 am

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AAA games do have a tendency to be overcommercialized, with rushed schedules, exploitative betas/preorders, and low quality both technically and as game designs.

There are a lot of crap indie games, but successful indie games tend to be successful because they're so polished and/or well-designed, rather than solely the result of any big marketing push behind them. There is a lot more art going into these indie games these days than AAA games.

Further, gamers tend to be the sort who buy into AAA's marketing hook, line and sinker. Thus GamerGate, a giant mob of gamers who have not one iota of a clue what they're talking about, seething with barely-concealed sexism and racism, in the name of somehow protecting the marketing BS they bought into as their identity.

None of this is to say there aren't any good AAA games, though. I enjoy several of them to various degrees, just as much as indie games.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2015, 01:36:55 am by Rusky » Logged
Offline (Unknown gender) TheExDeus
Reply #17 Posted on: January 29, 2015, 08:21:41 am

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Here, let's talk about MAX PAYNE (first edition) it was hyped for so many years.....when it came down to it it was a big fat ass disappointment......you could count the polygons with your hand, lighting effects were utter rubbish, level design was subpar, ending was crap.

Let's go way back to the DOS days and DUKE NUKEM 3D......another piece of shite hype........First level, ok.......but as you progressed it was so fucking boring and the level design was shite......was I an indie dev back then, fuck no, and I still am not !
You mean the first Max Payne? As I remember it got a lot of rewards in 2001 as the best game. And it really was good. I finished it like 20 times. And the graphics were one of the best at the time. And the story was VERY original and compelling compared to any other game before it. So that games is actually a good example on how to make good AAA games. DukemNukem3D was also fun. You're talking about "level design" as such thing really existed back then. There were many technical limitations on what you could do, and that meant most levels were very similar. And that was also regarded as revolutionary game in sense and won many game of the year awards. So while you personally might not like them, historically both of these games have been landmarks.

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Flappy bird was a success with popularity and download count but when it comes to the thril factor, everyone ive talked to (over 30 people ive asked this question) they all agree AAA console or PC games are much better, they justcant carry their Xbox or PC in their pocket like they can with their phone. They laughed at my question with the expacted response (and i quote "are you kidding? Dont you already know what my answer is?") Not everyone can afford console and decent PC games. Flappy bird is FREE. Can you name a single non-ouya non-indie console game that is free? GOOD LUCK if all console games were 100% free and could fit in your pocket without any loss in quality or performance, flappy bird wouldve never been downloaded. Everyone would be downloading the good stuff instead if it was just as accessable. People have their phones with them fucking EVERYWHERE therefore a lot more time on the hands to use it all the fucking time. Your console and PC is attached to your wall at  home, most people who have friends and a life usually dont spend that time at home unless its a depressing rainy day. Or if they are acrually in a gaming party mood, aka they wantvto play AA games because they are actually desirable and FUN. Where as with indie and mobile youll never see normal people spend a real "gaming party" on their phones playing flappy bird. People who resort to moble are BORED and refuse  be IDLE. Just because they are fullfilling their 5 five minutes with what would have otherise would be staring at the wall, doesnt mean they are having literal heaps of fun. It just means they are not in a position to be capable of doing anything else with time.
There are "pretty" games on mobiles too, like Infinity Blade and other UE3 games. And yet people played FlappyBird more. And not necessarily because it was free, but because it was addictive. Believe it or not but many people like frustrating (i.e. hard) games and beating them becomes almost an addiction. That is actually the appeal for most indie games. Bullet hell games were very popular historically and some indie remakes now have made them popular now. And they are more popular on mobile games just because their hard, and yet don't require a million things to do. On a phone the mechanics MUST be simple, purely because of the input method. So if you asked a person to buy a AAA game on a mobile phone, most people wouldn't, because it will frustrating, but for the wrong reason. Another reason why flappy bird was popular was just because people found it. Pewdiepie played it and then millions of people knew the game. Problem for most indie games is not that their bad, but that most people will not play ALL of them. And so they need a way to see if it's a good one or not. So they rely on youtubes, reviews and so on. The game itself was not complicated in its mechanics and there were actually games like that before. But this game was highlighted by people who have "media power" if you will, which makes people try it out. And many people liked it.
But the discussion is not actually about mobile games, but indie games on PC, so the whole point is quite  mute.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2015, 08:26:19 am by TheExDeus » Logged
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